In the recent editorial supporting the $40 billion in aid to the Ukraine (Press & Dakotan, June 7), I found a very ironic statement. This letter is neither in support or opposition to that aid.

However, the statement by the writer — “This is a pivotal moment in East-West relations, and the failure to stop Russia and Vladimir Putin’s ambitions here will mean they will have to be stopped elsewhere when he likely targets other former Soviet satellites in a quest to reestablish the old USSR empire” — was eerily reminiscent of words heard from the administrations of Lyndon Johnson and Richard Nixon some 50-plus years ago during the Vietnam War. Although paraphrasing, those statements said in effect that if we did not stop communism in South Vietnam, it would consume all of Southeast Asia one country at a time. Just to be clear that has not happened.

It seems we are making the same argument 50 years later for a different war.

(21) comments

Larry Skow

terrible waste of USA money. This incident is all but over. Biden/USA war mongers didn't provide Ukraine the needed polish MIGS at the critical juncture. All this was a "Dog & Pony" show. But just wait and see how this unfolds. Several Ukraine officials will escape to Paris or other safe spots live in exile and will have a never-ending supply of USA cash to live off of. Question will forever be asked--=-How many suitcases of cash did Pelosi & group bring back from their "trip over" to Ukraine. How many suitcases of cash did McConnell and group return with? The very next week a magic bi-partisian vote in Ukraines favor to give the $44 billion! But wait So. Dak got a paltry $2 billion to fix roads etc. Of course, that amount is ate away by inflation so in end you will get new gravel on roads/few new road signs/maybe new planks across some bridges. See all win out on this preventable farce/distraction.

SoDakD

🔴🔴🔴🔴🔴

Larry you’re right. We’ll have to: “…just wait and see how this unfolds.”

I’ll copy this post to revisit later. Your comments seem to be a premier example of healthy skepticism that’s metastasized into cancerous conspiracies.

SoDakD

Mr. Meyer, the question you raise certainly deserves an answer. However, we are actually making a DIFFERENT argument 50 years later for a DIFFERENT war.

The war in Ukraine is quite different from our war in Vietnam

I strenuously opposed our involvement in the Vietnam war. We supported several unpopular puppet governments in what was essentially a Civil War. We were falsely told the Communist “Dominoes” would fall if we stood by.

To see a thorough overview of this unfortunate war of choice read “Dereliction of Duty: Lyndon Johnson, Robert McNamara, the Joint Chiefs of Staff, and the Lies That Led to Vietnam '' by President Trump's former National Security Advisor General McMaster.

But in contrast to Vietnam, and unlike the various Vietnamese governments we were supporting, today’s Ukrainian government was duly elected in a free and fair election.

And they are fighting the Russians with a will and determination the South Vietnamese never had.

And you’re right - after our defeat in the Vietnam War the “dominoes“ never fell. But this conflict is different. Russia has ALREADY shown its expanding intention of conquest with its actions in Chechnya, Georgia, Syria and now Ukraine.

The dominoes have already fallen.

So no one has to predict what WILL happen. One only has to observe what already HAS happened.

Another important distinction: we are not putting American boots on the ground.

But what’s at stake here is whether we’ll have a rules-based world order or if powerful countries can gobble up their neighbors at will.

VoiceforAll

Good thing SoDakD supports this war, that's a relief, not surprising since it is Biden that let it happen anyways, if it was Trump, he and the rest of the democrats would be marching and protesting day and night, probably even burning down city blocks as they want to do when they don't get their way. And no need to worry about any of this anyways, Biden just committed another $1.2 billion dollars to this ongoing war that he could have prevented, why not, it's just money, he has lots of money making machines. Wonder how many families that $1.2 billion dollars would help here in the good old U.S. of A? He sure makes it seem easy sending billions of dollars to other countries while our own falls further and further into debt and chaos, but then again, that's what the democrats want. Wonder what happens when the recession hits and people start losing their jobs and taxes stop getting paid, guess he'll just have to print more money then he already is, seems that's his answer to everything anyways.

SoDakD

I’m amused watching you argue with your imagination once again, Voice.

Good job. I think you won!

But actually, Voice, I’m in good company. And really not just among Democrats.

A majority of US citizens support the Ukrainians, including Republicans. Many of these Republicans are rejecting the Putin-loving minority wing of the GOP and saying Biden should be doing more!

And I agree with them on this, Voice. Even if you don’t. Yes, let’s do more.

How ironic …🤷‍♂️❓

Larry Skow

SoDakD: You just can't admit your bumbling Biden and Woke crew lost another debacle by not acting. First Biden lost Afghanistan with botched bumbling and killed 13 marines. Lost $80 billion in arms. Now Ukraine. But you likely look at the "perfect" record he has. Face it it's over but the crying. Simply because he wouldn't give MIG's. Or did he plan it this way for his buddy Putin?

SoDakD

Larry, you’re having the same problem as Voice with establishing an internal consistency in your misinformation.

In one breath you decry the money Biden has sent to fight Putin and in the next you call Putin his “buddy”?

Larry Skow

SoDakD: You just can't grasp the farce/scam going on here can you O Wise Wizard of Yankton. Have you fallowed along how Biden is quietly encouraged companies to buy Russian made products while he "sanctions" Russia? Biden is scared of Putin he wets himself when his name is mentioned. Excluding the incident with Pope at Vatican of course. Face it SoDakD Putin has beat Biden and bunch like a drum at the parade. This war is over in Ukraine. All a scam & sham--but let the money presses roll and inflation to continue.

SoDakD

“This war is over in Ukraine.”

Maybe you should tell the Russians, Larry?

And be sure to copy the Europeans on this since they continue to send weapons and money to the Ukranians, as they ratchet up their sanctions on the Russians.

VoiceforAll

SoDakD, so exactly what part of Biden giving another $1.2 billion to Ukraine is misinformation? American tax payers have given billions of dollars to Ukraine, apparently CNN or MSNBC didn't report any of this yet? I always find it interesting that anything that goes against the democratic narrative, i.e. economy is great, economy is strong, inflation is transitory, it's Putin's fault, it's Trump's fault, it's the oil companies fault, it's the republican's fault, it's the guns fault, it's the previous administrations fault, it's China's fault, it's the baby formula companies fault, it's the rich peoples fault, it's OPEC's fault, $3 trillion = $0, the vaccine will keep you from getting Covid, on and on and on, it's labeled as misinformation (except who's fault it is, that is nothing but the truth, right SoDakD), and to the democrats, the argument is over, done, nothing more to see here, move on. Again, according to the democrats, tell a lie long enough and eventually everyone will start believing it, but that's not working SoDakD, everyone isn't believing it, in fact, most aren't, do we need to review Biden's and Kamala's poll numbers again?

SoDakD

Sure, Voice. If it pleases you, let's hear you recite the polls once again.

But the judgement of History will not be determined by polls. Or even several elections.

And I continue to be entertained watching you argue with your imagination once more.

But actually, Voice, when I declare my support for the Ukrainians, I’m in good company. And really not just among Democrats.

A majority of US citizens support the Ukrainians, including Republicans. Many of these Republicans are rejecting the Putin-loving minority wing of the GOP and saying Biden should be doing more!

And I agree with them on this, Voice. Even if you don’t. Yes, let’s do more.

How ironic …🤷‍

Do you believe with Larry that, “This war is over in Ukraine”?

You’ve taken so many positions on so many issues, it’s inexplicable to me why you’ve so carefully hidden your opinion from us.

VoiceforAll

I guess this is more misinformation SoDakD, illegal alien encounters at the southern border were 239,416 in May of this year. And Biden should be congratulated because he beat another record he set last year when it was 180,597 in May of 2021. Remarkably, under Trump, May of 2020 it was 23,237, but according to democrats, Trump's immigration policy was a disaster, really? So, roughly the number of people living in Sioux Falls came across our southern border, illegally, in one month, one month. Please tell me how this is misinformation SoDakD? Please tell me how this is sustainable for any state along the border, any city, any country for that matter? Millions upon millions of illegal immigrants, all needing 3 meals a day, a place to shower, a place to sleep, a place to go to the bathroom, healthcare, clothes, shoes. Who is supporting all this? Again, let's give the democrats California, Oregon and Washington, you can run them like you want, you can take all these millions of illegal aliens, anyone living in those three states can pay for everything they need, give them housing, give them food, give them everything, and let's see how long you last. Oh, and since you won't have any guns to protect yourselves, I am guessing crime is going to be worse than it already is in those 3 states, just a guess, because all these illegal aliens aren't fine, outstanding citizens of the countries they are coming from, but I am sure that is misinformation too, right SoDakD? Close the flippin' southern border now, or are you too busy worrying about Jan. 6th, yeah, that must be it, to many other "top priorates" for Biden and Kamala and you democrats, it's hard work destroying a country like ours, isn't it?

VoiceforAll

So, more misinformation here I guess, just the facts here people that will be denied by the democrats somehow. The Dow is now down 20% this year alone under the crush of Biden's policies and control, economists and manufacturers are predicting a recession and not until the first half of 2023, so the worst is yet to come folks. This is actually happening democrats, under your watch, under your control, because of your policies, regardless of who you blame or regardless if you call it misinformation, it is really happening, Americans are suffering and you all just stand by and watch it happen, denying it all, calling it all misinformation, well it isn't, is it now? Wonder when the "made for TV" series put on by the democrats will be about any of this or the 50 other failures of this administration? My guess, never, Jan. 6th is more important, to them at least, but not the rest of us.

SoDakD

Voice! Good news!

Trumpsters now have a justification for their outrage that the January 6th Commission “isn’t bipartisan.”

Yes, they’re finally right. At last it’s true!

Are you listening to the hearings? All the folks testifying against Mr. Trump are REPUBLICANS‼️

Not a Democrat among them⁉️

SoDakD

While you're at it, Larry, you should send a memo to the INSTITUTE for the STUDY of WAR telling them that Ukraine has already lost.

Today these folks are telling us that

“Western officials announced additional military aid for Ukraine on June 15.

US President Joe Biden pledged $1 billion worth of military aid, including coastal defense weapons, advanced rocket systems, artillery, and ammunition to support Ukrainian operations.

NATO members additionally announced they will continue to provide Ukraine with heavy weapons and long-range systems and plan to agree on a new assistance package after consultations with Ukraine’s Defense Ministry.

This newest round of military aid will be invaluable to support Ukrainian operations, especially in the face of increasingly protracted and artillery-heavy fighting against Russian forces in Eastern Ukraine, though Ukraine will require further sustained support.”

You say Biden is “wetting his pants” over fear of Putin. But you decry all the money and weapons he is sending to defeat Putin. Which is it?

Can you please be internally consistent with your misinformation? You’re worse than Voice.

My crystal ball is in the shop, Larry. But I appreciate your confident prognostications. Be sure to remember to tell me “I told you so” if your clairvoyance is born out.

And you can be sure I’ll remember your words if the Russians are defeated or even just held at bay.

Putin went in to conquer Ukraine in its entirety, and now after suffering unimaginable losses of men and material he’s reduced to squabbling over a minor city like Severodonetsk.

Seems to me if “it’s all over but the crying” (as you tell us), it must be Putin who’s shedding the tears.

I think he’s made a terrible military blunder that ranks with Bush's War on Iraq.

I’m sure we’ll be discussing this as these events unfold…

Larry Skow

SoDakD: When I said this war is over. I meant Ukraine is beaten or about to get beaten. Your great President Biden let Ukraine down big time when he blocked the Polish MIG jets from being given to Ukraine. That was at critical junction when Russia could have been driven back. BIDEN BUMBLED, Ukraine paid the price of the battlefield for Biden's stupidity or as it because Putin's friendship with Biden and Hillary. Regardless Ukraine lost---well except for the $44 billion plus given so the Ukraine leaders will live in comfort in exile.

SoDakD

What a bold prognostication, Larry

I am getting most of my information from the INSTITUTE FOR THE STUDY OF WAR. And they’re giving a very different picture.

I’d be curious to know where you’re getting your information.

SoDakD

Larry, I can’t fathom where you are getting your information, here’s Saturday evening‘s report on the war in Ukraine from the Institute for the Study of War:

“Russian forces made marginal gains on the outskirts of Severodonetsk on June 18 but have largely stalled along other axes of advance.

Russian troops are likely facing mounting losses and troop and equipment degradation that will complicate attempts to renew offensive operations on other critical locations as the slow battle for Severodonetsk continues.

As ISW previously assessed, Russian forces will likely be able to seize Severodonetsk in the coming weeks, but at the cost of concentrating most of their available forces in this small area.

Other Russian operations in eastern Ukraine—such as efforts to capture Slovyansk and advance east of Bakhmut—have made little progress in the past two weeks. Russian forces are continuing to fight to push Ukrainian troops away from occupied frontiers north of Kharkiv City and along the Southern Axis, but have not made significant gains in doing so, thus leaving them vulnerable to Ukrainian counteroffensive and partisan pressure.”

I’d be fascinated if you were able to send me links to your sources. Do you have any?

I’ll be even more fascinated to see how the Ukrainians will do once they get long range artillery into play.

Most of your opinions are too strange to fact check. But your prediction that Ukraine is going down to defeat leaves you out on a limb, old buddy. Reality will fact check you sooner or later.

Now you’re playing Abe’s game, “Just You Wait!”

And I notice he’s not saying much these days.

Larry Skow

SoDakD: The Ukraine war will drag on for years: Russia has upper hand. More men more funds more weapons--China is more then likely funding some of Russia. But Russia will continue to sell its oil/gas on world market. There will always be buyers. Iran kept on selling its oil regardless of sanctions--Russia will do the same. In the end counties will lose interest in supporting Ukraine. Its already happening. It's as good as done--just going to take time--All in Russia's favor. Biden choked his chicken at critical time and didn't supply Ukraine the Polish MIG's when Russia could of been driven back. Just sat on his backside and choked his chicken.

SoDakD

And this is why I say “…you’re playing Abe’s game, “Just You Wait!”

Already the Russians’ tremendous losses of men and equipment have forced them to drastically scale back their conquest of Ukraine.

Now they’re relegated to trying to hold on to a little slice of Ukraine’s sovereign territory.

Eventually we’ll see if you’ll find your “I told you so” future as elusive as Abe has…

SoDakD

“Russia could of been driven back,” you say, Larry.

But if you’d been paying attention, you might have noticed that the Ukrainians🇺🇦 decimated Putin’s 40-mile long tank column attacking Kiev.

The whipped Russians were sent skedaddling back to safety in Mother Russia. Thus ended Russia's opening phase of their plan to conquer the whole of Ukraine🇺🇦.

Seems to me Russia WAS driven back. At least for now.

Putin’s been playing the B teams in Chechnya, Georgia and Syria. Maybe he should have tried to organize a few “one car parades” 🚗 before going up against a determined adversary like Zelinsky’s Ukraine🇺🇦.

And Biden didn’t “just sit on his backside” but instead worked with our NATO allies to provide much of the weaponry that made this possible.

Plus his administration helped organize the sanctions that may eventually bleed the Russians war machine to death.

You and Voice🎤 may be betting on a loser, Larry.

Seems to me it was Putin who “choked his chicken.” 🐥

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